[00:00:00] Speaker A: I'm Dr. Dante Vaughn, business strategist, culture architect, guide to leaders who want more than status.
Leadership isn't just glossy headlines and perfect wins.
[00:00:12] Speaker B: On Everyday Leaders Unfiltered, we bring you
[00:00:15] Speaker A: honest conversations about what happens behind the curtain. The real setbacks, the real pivots, real growth from culture shifts to personal mastery, from trust crises to team turnarounds. This is where leaders get raw, real, and ready.
Because a leader who's unfiltered might just become unforgettable.
[00:00:49] Speaker B: Welcome to Everyday leaders unfiltered. I'm Dr. Dante Vaughn, and today we're going behind the polished leadership talk into the part that really runs the show. What's happening inside of us when no one is watching. I'm really excited today because we have a special guest, licensed professional counselor, military veteran, adjunct professor, who just happens to be my twin sister as well.
My guest, David Vaughn, has clients that she works with virtually throughout Georgia, Texas, Tennessee. She specializes in matters surrounding ocd, anxiety, relationships, you name it. She's an expert in assessing, analyzing, diagnosing, understanding the challenges and how to overcome them on a personal level and. And through the lens of what it means to be a high performer and lead others, when in fact, we haven't faced our personal challenges. What happens. What does it mean when we have to face ourselves in order to become the best version to show up in the lives of others?
Davita, welcome to the show.
[00:02:09] Speaker C: Thank you so much for having me.
[00:02:10] Speaker B: I'm so excited, and it's so funny because I have notes prepared and all these things, but this is my twin. This is my sis. Yeah, She's. She's. She's on her journey to become Dr. Vaughn. So I'm excited to have you here, and. And let's just have a awesome, candid conversation.
[00:02:31] Speaker C: Right.
[00:02:31] Speaker B: When I. When I think about this topic, you know, I want to. I want to first in. In our first segment, get after
[00:02:40] Speaker C: this
[00:02:40] Speaker B: idea of strength,
[00:02:46] Speaker A: leadership.
[00:02:46] Speaker B: Strength can be real, or for many, it's simply a mask, because for many of us, composure is more emotional avoidance than it truly is.
Navigating what we're experiencing on a personal level and how that influences how we show up in the lives of others as professionals, but also in our personal lives.
So eventually, I think it manifests in the.
Through the lens of frustration, burnout, disconnection, all those other things that happen.
Right.
So I want to guide our first segment around a central question.
To get to know you while also starting to unpack what it means to navigate self through the lens of leadership.
[00:04:00] Speaker C: People.
[00:04:05] Speaker B: Have A misconception that showing up as a leader has a certain look to it and there's a certain demeanor and application.
How have you encountered in your profession trying to fit the facade of what it means to serve in a leadership capacity versus what you may have been experiencing internally? So I want to start with you personally, because then I'm going to navigate to, through the lens of then what's required for us as individuals, as leaders to start to unpack what's happening internally in order to then show up and be as effective as we can be. So I want to start with you.
[00:04:57] Speaker C: You know, I think imposter syndrome is real, right? Like the idea that at least for me, when my opportunity to be in leadership either, you know, in the military by, you know, getting, you know, asked to lead the flight or something, or when in, you know, working in more corporate environments, it's always been an internal question of, can I really do this?
And particularly when it comes to leadership, you know, it's so easy to adopt a shadow, right? To just sort of like fade into the corner over there and not really stand out. And when you are leading a team of people or you're leading your own project, or you're leading, in my case, my own practice even, there's this need to be in the light. Right. And the things that we maybe are insecure about, the things that maybe we question or maybe we've not even heard enough, Congratulations in that is what I definitely noticed for myself, just that I, yeah, I just questioned everything.
Even though, you know, obviously nothing was handed to. Maybe that's not obvious, but nothing was handed to me. Right. So it was more about just noticing, like, yeah, I'm in this position and I got here because these other people have positioned me in this way and my skill set or my ability has brought me here. But the question of do I belong here?
So persistent, so persistent, like unbelievable. So
[00:06:45] Speaker B: I definitely can resonate. But also what comes to mind for me as you speak to this sense of imposter syndrome, Self validation, self affirmation, which it sounds like you had to navigate to overcome this question, or of belonging in your capacity doesn't come easy for many.
Oftentimes I've been in positions where I've challenged a leader to articulate, what value do you bring?
What expertise do you profess?
You probably won't be surprised at how many individuals struggle with articulating that. They can tell you technical execution, but validating for themselves with confidence and affirmation.
I belong here. Here's the value that I bring is a difficult thing. What do you think causes people to struggle with connecting with this personal sense of validity and groundedness and where they are and where they belong?
[00:08:07] Speaker C: I think it's difficult to be honest with ourselves as human beings. Like, I think we all think we do it, but I think it's easier.
Like, just think about, like the typical workplace, right. Let's say you're in a job and you don't enjoy what you do. Or maybe you do. But anyway, the resignation letter is always easier to write than the resume.
[00:08:29] Speaker B: Amen.
[00:08:30] Speaker C: Right. It's always easier to write. It's always easier to identify the things that are wrong.
And I think that we're better at doing that in other people than we are in ourselves.
[00:08:43] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:08:43] Speaker C: So I think it requires, if we're talking about how to identify my own value, that leader you ask that question to has to firstly have enough humility to acknowledge that there are things within them that they don't value and then acknowledge, okay, the things that I do value do not equal perfect things. Right. They're just qualities that I have, characteristics that I have or skills that I have that can always improve and always, you know, develop and grow. I really think it's because we just aren't great at being honest with ourselves about the things that matter most.
[00:09:19] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah.
There's a vulnerability that comes with self reflection, acknowledgement of our challenges, flaws, and oftentimes, to your point, drifting into the space of vulnerability feels scary.
And for many of us, we shift to a place of fear, and our fear responses manifest in different ways.
And I know something that I've learned about myself, which has been profound, is I have a fight response that of course manifests in different ways in different scenarios and circumstances. But I'm inclined to be on the defense even with oneself, and that defense can almost manifest in the form of rationalization, justification,
[00:10:32] Speaker C: or intellectualizing. Right?
[00:10:35] Speaker B: Yes, right.
Are there any.
When you think about this self journey before, but, you know, as we're trying to emerge as the greatest leaders in our lives, personally and professionally, this self journey of overcoming imposter syndrome, personal reservations with self critique, what are some tools or methods that we can apply to start to break down or acknowledge that we have the reservation, fear, hesitancy, whatever it may be, and to start to still overcome that and work through it,
[00:11:19] Speaker C: I would say the first thing that is helpful is using the right language. Like you just identified the cognitive distortions we all have and strategies we all use. Right. We all intellectualize, we all overgeneralize, minimize Whatever, we all do it.
But I think having the right language, because a lot of people won't call fear fear.
You know what I mean? So a lot of leaders, therefore, are not acknowledging that they are afraid to lead. They might say things like, oh, this is a new experience for me, and, you know, I'm just getting my footing or whatever, they'll find every other way to say that.
[00:11:57] Speaker B: Just getting my footing. So true.
[00:11:59] Speaker C: But when they're scared, because fear is healthy, it's a reasonable response. When we're afraid of the right thing, right now, if we're afraid of our own failure, which is typically what imposter syndrome can be sort of anchored in, is I feel like I don't belong here and that I somehow fooled everyone around me into thinking that I should be here.
It's often anchored in because I'm afraid to fail. What if I fail? What if I disappoint the people around me? What if I betray myself in my own dreams and my own desires? Acknowledging that with the right language, I think is a wonderful first step.
Because when that leader begins to say, instead of, I'm just finding my footing or, you know, whatever fancy way of saying it, when they start instead of saying I'm nervous, and they begin to say, I'm afraid, the way you approach nervousness is very different than the way you approach fear.
[00:12:52] Speaker B: You bet, right?
[00:12:53] Speaker C: So I would say finding that language first. And again, that requires humility. It requires the honesty and courage. It takes a lot of courage to say, well, damn. I mean, sorry, for example, you're fine.
One of the things that I noticed that I do or did, and I've worked really hard on, is I used to use a hundred words to say one thing, right? And I didn't. I had to be honest with myself, especially in environments where I'm surrounded by people who have accomplished the thing I wish to accomplish or have done more, right?
And I had to acknowledge that the reason that I did that was one, because I was afraid of being misunderstood and not communicating myself well, and two, because I was trying to hide what I was insecure about, which was my own intellect.
So I was using all of these words to hide the very thing I was afraid of, right?
So once I was honest with myself, it went from I'm afraid of being misunderstood, which was partially true, to I'm afraid of being perceived as stupid because the approach is different.
You see what I'm saying? Like, the approach is not the same for those two things. I don't want to go on a tangent But I get it. That's an example of how we can begin to be honest with ourselves and use the right language.
[00:14:14] Speaker B: So what? So I, I love that example and and many of our viewers and listeners alike. And I can, even for myself, I remember having earned, I can say now, a seat at a table that I didn't feel I belonged and my fears manifested in manners that were ineffective in achieving my ultimate objective.
Elevated voice, more argumentative than persuasive.
Hyper vigilance to a fault.
These are behaviors I can look back on and acknowledge they were all grounded in insecurities and fears, essentially of not being seen as someone who had the level of strategic understanding to influence or move the room.
But to your point, what I heard you say is as we explore this self acknowledgement and reflection, being honest with oneself and finding the words to get as close to what we are truly experiencing emotionally and psychologically is only going to ultimately serve us.
To reach a true state of vulnerability and get to a place where we can actually not try to control or stifle that experience, but acknowledge it for its existence and.
Really get to its root cause requires us to stop, to pause, to speak it.
And the minute we do that, we begin to get on this path of getting beyond no longer becomes a barrier, it becomes a propeller.
I liken it to feedback I've given new leaders when they're engaging with a new team, especially those who were peers are now subordinates and oftentimes there's a propensity due to insecurity as part of that elevation to want to go on this spectrum of either I've been where you've been and I'm your friend, don't worry, nothing's going to change to kicking the door in, figuratively weapons blazing, and everything's going to change and we're doing things differently starting immediately today.
And I liken it to the feedback I always give, which is more centered around what are you experiencing. And the closer you can get to be getting comfortable with expressing that experience with your team members, the more likely that you start to establish authority through vulnerability and credibility with your peers. When you can say I'm excited, I'm nervous, I'm afraid to take on this role one because I'm not completely sure what comes with it. But also I'm concerned that I may not show up as the leader that you all expect me to be.
[00:18:09] Speaker C: But that requires humility and it does. You have to be humble 100%.
[00:18:14] Speaker B: So I want to unpack in our next segment, more around this conversation of humility because I think many of our listeners and viewers define humility in different ways.
And I know you've done a lot of research in the context of humility. So I want to unpack that further and so we can start to connect to okay, so what does that mean in its tangibility?
Because ultimately, unless and until we start to unpack what's real and true for us and how and how it influences our impact that we're able to have on others, we are minimizing the true power and strength that we that we possess and our ability to and positively influence or even transform the lives of the people around us.
Up next, as I shared earlier, I'm going to get into this this conversation around humility. What does that really mean in the context of how we show up in our lives?
And from there I want to get into this idea around emotional intelligence and the perceptions that come with it. Does emotional intelligence always mean calm and polished, or does it mean something more and possibly complex?
Because emotional avoidance is also often connected to one's ability or inability to nurture their emotional intelligence.
So tune in.
[00:20:17] Speaker A: Leadership isn't just glossy headlines and Perfect wins. I'm Dr. Dante Vaughn, business strategist, culture architect, guide to leaders who want more than status. On Everyday Leaders Unfiltered. We bring you honest conversations about what's happening happening behind the curtain. Real setbacks, real pivots, real growth from culture shifts to personal mastery, from trust crises to team turnarounds. This is where leaders get raw, real and ready. Everyday Leaders Unfiltered. Premiere soon on NOW Media Television because a leader who's unfiltered might just become unforgettable.
[00:21:10] Speaker B: Stay connected to this show and every NOW Media TV favorite, live or on demand, anytime you like. Just Download the free Now Media TV app on Roku or iOS and unlock non stop bilingual programming in English and Spanish. Vanish if you're on the move. That's okay. Catch the podcast
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welcome back to Everyday Leaders Unfiltered. I'm still here with my twin sister and licensed professional counselor Davita Vaughn, and we've been unpacking this self reflective opportunity to overcome the internal barriers that we have as it relates to our fears that we encounter when we're trying to show up and be effective as leaders both personally and professionally. And what came out of that really started to lean in the context of humility.
How do we nurture our capacity to practice humility as a catalyst to acknowledging what we're experiencing in order to show up with the level of transparency and vulnerability as a leader. So we're going to unpack that further. And as part of that conversation, I want to navigate emotional intelligence. What does that mean and how does it show up in those who are practiced in nurturing their immersion development around their emotional intelligence and those who are less skilled and what's required?
And I don't believe it's emotional avoidance dressed up as professionalism. So I want to unpack that further.
Davita, thanks so much for the dialogue that we've experienced and we've experienced thus far.
So we talked about humility, and I think it's, it's, it's spot on.
How does one first effectively define humility?
Because one, I hear the term humbleness and humility used interchangeably, and I think that's a flawed understanding.
But I want you to validate or confirm that for me or not.
And then how does one then begin to actually nurture their ability to practice humility so that they can get to the state of vulnerability and transparency and ability to share their experiences and connect with others in their experience?
[00:23:56] Speaker C: So the definition of humility that I and I would use those terms interchangeably. So I'm really curious about your thoughts about why they're different or what makes.
[00:24:06] Speaker B: Sure, sure, sure.
[00:24:08] Speaker C: But the, the definition that is agreed upon anyway in psychology, and I'm talking about all branches of psychology, is a right understanding of oneself. Right. So that means understanding your strengths and your limitations.
And I. Well, now that I've said that out loud, humbleness might be more in that social exchange. We might be talking about humility in action when we talk about humbleness.
[00:24:38] Speaker B: By the way, your distinction is already getting close to my understanding of the difference, so I'm glad you arrived there.
[00:24:48] Speaker C: I was using them interchangeably, changeably. But I do tend to speak about humility specifically.
So, yeah, I mean, so the part of your question is, you know, how do we know that we're humble people? Is that what you asked?
[00:25:02] Speaker B: Well, there's the knowing and to your point, recognizing that you may or may be more or less than humble.
So, yes, I think that's an important aspect of it. But then it's okay, now that I know I need to work on this, how do I effectively work on it? So really two part.
[00:25:22] Speaker C: Yeah, so. So I would say awareness of whether or not you are more or less humble, which is a great phrasing for it, because I would say it's a spectrum. Right.
Humility is something that. It's a process. Right. And so My thoughts about it are to know if you're humble is to look at your life and see where you are best caring for other people.
Okay? Because humility is as much an action as it is a character trait, if you will. So in the research you'll see discussion of humility is primarily in the realm of moral psychology, right? That's where you see a lot of discussion of humility is in the idea of is it something that we have as moral people? Is it something that we develop?
What does it really look like to be humble? And there was this idea that humility was like self abasement and it was never acknowledging any good thing. But that's false, right? Like that's not a real authentic humility.
Real, authentic humility is saying I am equally able and aware of, able to express and I am aware of my strengths and my limitations, right? So in the hypothetical leader that we were talking about earlier, the one who maybe kicks the door in when you know, that leader might struggle with acknowledging limitations, right? Because those limitations get masked all the time by kicking doors in. And this is everything that's going to have to change.
The hypothetical leader who goes to the team that they once were a part of and now lead, the humble leader would say, hey guys, like I am so grateful to be here. I'm grateful that my skill set and my abilities were acknowledged, right? And also I am here with you because there are lots of things that you all know better than me, right? So being able to acknowledge strengths and limitations is a necessary.
You know, if it's a math equation, strength plus limitation equals humble, right? Like, you know, knowing that both of those things need to be present. When someone leans too far in strengths, they're prideful.
Only ever acknowledging what you're strong at, only ever acknowledging what you're good at. Only ever, right? You become arrogant, you become prideful. I should say we, because I think all human people do that. And then if you lean too far in the limitations, okay, well now you are self abasing and now you are failing to acknowledge. It's like the person who is freaking. You ever meet somebody who's just like gorgeous but never seems to know it?
Right? And so I would say of that person, that's not humility. Humility is the ability to say, you know what?
I know I don't look like a bag of rocks, but there are things I'd like to improve, right? Like that's what humility truly looks like. I think we struggle with that idea of humility though, because humility is Conveyed in media, it's conveyed in books, it's conveyed in these different avenues as piety and it's linked directly to religiosity.
So it's harder, I think, for people to self evaluate because what about the non religious person? How are they going to evaluate their own humility?
[00:28:46] Speaker B: Yeah, so.
[00:28:48] Speaker C: Yeah, so I hope I answered your.
[00:28:49] Speaker B: You did. And so a few things come to mind and we can almost have its own show. Right. Which we may.
When I think about the implication of humility from, from a leadership perspective and in really life perspective, I liken the distinction between humble and humility or humbleness and humility.
Humility, the act of humble, the state of right to be humble, translates in acts of humility.
[00:29:38] Speaker C: Sure.
[00:29:39] Speaker B: Which is why from its interchangeability, they don't, I don't think they're interchangeable, but they are relative and synergistic. Different, different forms, just different forms of the same perceived impact.
Now, with that being said, why I don't use them interchangeably with intentionality in that humble to what I'm hearing you reference, that has a lot to do with mindset, To influence action.
Because if I don't believe it is important, necessary, Requisite, I won't.
It doesn't matter.
So oftentimes the act of, or the influence of being humble, there's a catalyst, an external catalyst to someone's mindset shifting, surrounding its importance.
[00:30:54] Speaker C: Yeah. Humiliation.
[00:30:55] Speaker B: Yeah.
I want to get there. Right.
[00:30:58] Speaker A: Because.
[00:30:58] Speaker B: Because oftentimes I think humility is referenced without acknowledging that unless and until one's mindset puts them in a place to be able to practice humility, then it becomes a factor that is almost more threatening than it is uplifting.
So you lead me right to this other point that I want to unpack with you, which is, does practicing humility or being humble require.
Factors that humiliate, challenge, critique?
Is that a requisite for humility to exist?
[00:32:03] Speaker C: That's a good question. So I think the answer is yes and no. And what I mean is humiliation, while it has a hugely negative connotation, isn't always some sinister thing that happens to a person that squishes them and brings them off their mountaintop or whatever. That's not always how it happens.
[00:32:25] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:32:26] Speaker C: Now, if you happen to fall from a mountaintop, then maybe you shouldn't have been up there. Right.
Or maybe when you were up there, there was something that was necessary. The fall was necessary. Right.
What's the thing? The pride goes before the fall. Right.
So yes, I think that those who lean toward acknowledging only strengths probably do experience character building things as humiliation. So that's why my answer is yes and no.
Because there are things that we experience as human being matter what position we're in, be it all the way at the top in the C suite or you know, the guy, you know, the person cleaning the floors, right? No matter what it is, we all experience things in our life that cause us to either reveal our character or build our character. And I think that character revealing things can be experienced as humiliation, right? Character building things can bring about humility.
And I think that depending on the person, depending on, you know, sort of where they are on that spectrum, if you will, I think they will have an experience of humiliation that maybe I wouldn't or maybe you wouldn't, you know. So if as an example, if someone were to come into this space right now and say, oh, Evita, you've got a stain on your shirt, right? Well, if I am aware of my own limitations and I know that I tend to be sloppy, I'm going to chuckle at that. I'm going to be like, oh, well, staying on my shirt, right? I'm not going to be humiliated by that moment, right? I'm not going to receive it as critique.
Whereas hypothetically, that same thing happens to you if your emotional intelligence, right, if you lack your own emotional, like if you have no eq, you might not be aware that you're receiving it as humiliation, but you might handle it in the moment and then leave here and think about it for the next four days, right? Because now you've experienced this thing that. Because it revealed your character to you, right? And it revealed something about you and it didn't build you up, it tore you down.
So yes, I think that the answer is yes and no. And I think whether or not something is humiliating or even embarrassing is based on how a person experiences themselves and understands themselves.
[00:34:51] Speaker B: So when I think about this conversation around humility and humbleness from a leadership or organizational leadership perspective, to foster a culture of.
High performance requires the mindset that it's okay to be imperfect, it's okay to fail, it's okay to not achieve or acknowledge the failures that led to not achieving a specific goal or action.
Organizations spend so much time fostering a culture of high performance centered around only positive results.
And humiliation through the lens of not achieving a goal or objective becomes the catalyst, perceived catalyst to improvement. But it's delivered or presented in through a negative experience, chastising corrective action, disciplinary action, instead of viewing limitations through the lens of similar to what you spoke to our strengths were here, we failed here.
And we're exploring the root of those failures so that we can do better. Future state.
And oftentimes I enter organizations where that is not fostered, that's not promoted. It's not promoted at the senior most leadership level. Thus then those leaders don't translate or foster that with their teams. And of course, that comes from personal experiences and how they view failure, personal failure and how they navigate it, and then also how the organization fosters that. So to your point, humbleness and practice is acknowledging, even in perceived success or failure, there's things that went well, there's things that didn't.
And both are okay in the context that we're not resigning to failure, we're simply acknowledging it. Because the only way to get to root cause or understanding its true importance or impact is to recognize it, accept it. And then.
[00:37:34] Speaker C: Yeah, and that's the difference, I think, between the humble leader and the defeated leader, right? Because I think some, well, I've encountered at least one leader who in the, in the midst of, like, exploring, okay, what is preventing success.
And, okay, I found the root cause, right? But there is no such thing as a single root, right. Have you ever looked at the underbed of flowers or a plant or a tree?
There's always branches, right? Roots are a system, right? And so we live within systems, we think with systems in mind. That's how we are as people. So that leader that I'm thinking of anyway discovered, okay, one branch, one little pathway in a whole system, and I think that it prevented that leader from moving from defeat. Right? Because, you know, sometimes people experience just not earning what you expect to earn in a quarter as humiliation, right? Why? Because it's about other people, right? What do investors think and what do. What will the consumers think? And.
Right.
But this leader really failed to understand that it's a part of a system and I think really became defeated, not humble, right? So I think that whether or not we become humble people or develop a sense for limitations that are acceptable to have, like not accepting the limitation is part of the problem. And I think that keeps us in defeat. You know what I mean? But I do think that it's very easy to miss an opportunity to grow in that way because I think humble people are also very authentic people, right?
So like, missing an opportunity to grow in that way and become more authentic is often, I would imagine, because of just a defeatist mentality. You know, not recognizing like an entirety of a system or understanding that this is just because there is a system it doesn't mean that you can't have progress or you know, make, you know, so anyway.
[00:39:39] Speaker B: Yeah, no, no, I think that's spot on. There's so many other things that come to mind, even in the context of individuals who have, who struggle with conditioning that suggest limitations equal weakness.
[00:39:59] Speaker C: Sure, yeah.
[00:40:01] Speaker B: And weakness equal is viewed through a negative lens.
However, when I think about my son, your nephew, I know that he has limitations in how much weight he can carry. Right through his lens, he sees daddy carrying two shopping bags of groceries. He wants to help daddy. He can only carry one.
Through my eyes I recognize a almost six year old can only carry but so many pounds.
That limitation is reasonable, right? And expected.
Through his lens, his inability or his limitation of one bag and inability to carry two has an opportunity to be viewed through.
I'm weak because I can't carry what daddy carries, or through the lens of wow, I'm able to carry one. I can't wait to when I get stronger or bigger or older where I can carry two or more.
What do you believe in that example is the catalyst to that distinction in thought mindset that enables someone to distinguish weakness from opportunity?
[00:41:40] Speaker C: Yeah, that's a great question. I think two things are factors. The first is Dylan will become aware, either because you'll tell him or because he'll learn it as he grows, that he is self determining, right? So he can become stronger.
And part of that is, you know, in this example, like, oh, like he'll learn about the anatomy of the body and he'll learn that, oh, like if you do this with your muscles, you'll build them, right? And so there's this idea of like sometimes it's just the right application of knowledge, which is wisdom, right? So it's he'll gain wisdom, you, you know, and he'll understand. I am self determining. I think the second thing that is the distinction between I'm weak or I'm exactly, I'm just right. I'm exactly where I'm expected to be given my age and circumstance and all the things.
I think that it's not just about being self determining or unknowing, but it's also about understanding that enough is good enough. I think very often human beings think that there is such a vast difference between enough and good enough or good and good enough, right?
Nope, there really isn't.
Other than what we say. Other than what we say, the distinction is, so if now say Dylan's 16 years old and Dylan has awareness of circumstance, body, et cetera, and Dylan, you're carrying four bags. Right. Understanding that your age now might be perceived differently to Dylan than it is today. Right. Right now, Dylan's little daddy's big and strong. Dylan's 16. Daddy might be perceived differently. I don't know. Right. Either way, however, his mindset toward the thing he's looking at and evaluating himself against is going to determine whether or not he sees it as weakness, his circumstance. What am I evaluating myself against? Right. Because that's really what we do. All of it is about social interactions and we always make appraisals and we're always sort of looking at, you know, who am I as compared to who this person is and am I strong or weak? Am I limited or not? When we can say, I acknowledge that I will not be a bodybuilder.
Not an example, it's a reality. I'm there. I'm not going to be a bodybuilder. Does that mean I cannot be a bodybuilder? No. Right. It means I will not be a bodybuilder because I know my limitations. I know what? What? Because a limitation, again, it's enough, like it's enough to not be that thing. It's enough to lift 20 pounds and not 200. It's enough. I think that so often we appraise ourselves as weak when we really could just be saying we're enough.
Really could just be saying no.
[00:44:34] Speaker B: That's well said and from a leadership context. So we've navigated in the first segment this desire for or necessity to be vulnerable. Vulnerable for the sake of self reflection and self awareness.
But to do that, there's the requisite of being humble or practicing humility as part of that process.
And to do so, there's a level of acknowledgment, but also acceptance.
I can't transcend growth beyond unless I first accept my current state and understanding that I am in more control of my current state than any other individual or circumstance or factor. Right.
[00:45:28] Speaker C: Yeah, I was going to speak to that, but we'll, we'll do that in the next segment.
[00:45:32] Speaker B: Perfect. So with that being said, how do you individuals begin to lean in once they recognize that hey, I am enough, or what we've done was enough and we're trying to push beyond it now.
So there comes the elevation.
What's required psychologically for an individual to reach that at a personal level?
And another thing I want to unpack in the next segment is then what's necessary to then start to foster that culture with individuals being led.
How do I nurture that Sense of.
Look, there's a reality to what we do in business, especially where that was okay, but for us to hit our goals next quarter, we need more, right? So how do we balance the sense of enough with we still gotta need more or do more or how do I recognize the demands of my role are expanding? So. So what was enough may not be enough anymore. How do we. How do we navigate that, but also through this lens of humility.
So we're going to unpack all of that in our next segment. Stay tuned.
[00:47:28] Speaker A: Leadership isn't just glossy headlines and Perfect wins. I'm Dr. Dante Vaughn, business strategist, culture architect, guide to leaders who want more than status. On Everyday Leaders Unfiltered, we bring you honest conversations about what's happening behind the curtain. Real setbacks, real pivots, real growth from culture shifts to personal mastery, from trust crises to team turnarounds. This is where leaders get raw, real and ready. Everyday Leaders unfiltered. Premiere soon on NOW Media Television. Because a leader who's unfiltered might just become unforgettable.
[00:48:21] Speaker B: Welcome back, everyone. I've been. I've been giggling behind the camera because I have my twin sister here. We've been navigating what it means to both be self reflective in all of our strengths and our limitations as leaders, how that manifests through our own insecurities, what's required for us to overcome those insecurities, which includes the spirit practice of humility and what that really means. And it has a lot to do with acknowledging both our limitations and the opportunities that come with it. In this segment, we're transitioning from something that I think many of our viewers and listeners are thinking or chewing on and aren't quite clear on. And that is what happens when we acknowledge our limitations as a leader or as a team.
But we're also challenged with expanding beyond those limitations to realize a goal even when what we've done thus far has been acceptable. How do we push past it? How do we stretch ourselves even with those limitations in mind or at heart? So we're going to unpack that further with David Vaughn.
Let's get after it.
[00:49:38] Speaker C: Okay.
[00:49:40] Speaker B: When I think about leadership effectiveness and this desire to motivate, to inspire, to drive performance from an organizational perspective, how does one walk with humbleness, practice humility, understand our limitations, celebrate the wins and the losses for what they reveal, while also saying, I need more, we gotta do more. Third quarter requires X instead of Y.
We have to be more lean, whatever those demands may be. How does one push past Those, those initial targets or goals while also acknowledging we have limitations.
[00:50:33] Speaker C: Sure, yeah, great question.
So a limit is not finite and enough is time limited.
So what I mean by that is if in quarter one, we are way under what we expected, but our lights are still on, then we did enough.
Right. Because it's time limited. Enough is not necessarily suggesting that you have enough always. That's true for all areas of life in all domains. Okay. We don't always have enough. Always. Right.
So enough is time limited. But it is important to acknowledge enough. Right. And that is a psychological strategy to get beyond enough. When you can acknowledge enough, lights on, boom, cool.
Payrolls paid, boom. Right? Everybody got paid, everybody got bonuses or whatever. The things are cool, no investors pulled out, cool. Right. Whatever that thing is, now I can move beyond enough to whatever more looks like. And to define more, you have to realize two things, I think.
One is there are two ways of thinking about what we are capable of.
In psychology, we call it internal locus of control and external locus of control. Okay. These are terms that might actually be familiar to many of the listeners here, just given, you know, popular culture. Right. Internal locus of control is the way I like to teach it anyway, is I acknowledge that I happen to the world and I believe that I do.
External locus of control is I think the world happens to me and I have very little control.
Earlier you were saying like you were thinking as a leader who has very high internal locus of control, right? I believe I happen to the world. I believe that my company happens to the world. I believe that all of its staff happens to the world. All these employer employees happen to the world. Right. That's how you get beyond. If you have a leader who believes that up the market's happening to me right now there are things that obviously we cannot control about the market. But if you only believe that things are happening to you, things are happening to your company, your, your employees are happening to you, and it's your employees fault that everything is going through, okay? And everything's not working, then you will never get beyond ever.
There is a healthy balance between the two. When you can think about your thinking, which is also a strategy I would recommend for getting beyond the enough.
When you can think about your thinking, then you can hear yourself say stuff that don't help, that doesn't help you, right? When you learn how to think about your thinking and all that quiet, all that requires is enough time and space and quiet to be able to think about your thinking. Some people are very good at that. I would argue that Some very strong leaders are very good at that. Also, humble people are very, very good at that because they know the way I'm thinking about this thing right now, the way I'm thinking about my company's performance this quarter is putting all the blame on the employees.
It's putting all the blame on the market. Why am I doing that?
Now I'm thinking about the why behind the thing and I arrive at, oh, well, that's because I think everything's happening to me. You know, what kind of helplessness that actually produces to think like that. You know what I mean? No, you're not going to get beyond enough.
And then when you get beyond the first sort of strata of enough, there's another one.
Because you're gonna earn more, right? And you're gonna do more. And guess what's gonna happen? Expansion.
Right. And then you're at enough again. And so you have to continuously be creative in the way that you understand how you happen to the world. And you have to be creative in the way that you find balance between understanding how the world happens to. To you.
So am I making sense or am I?
[00:54:31] Speaker B: You are. And to your point, from an organizational leadership context, a leader, what I hear you saying is a leader's examination of or distinction of what's enough and what's more begins with their own understanding, their own reflection, their own articulation of it. Because then that influences the how they translated to their team members.
I could hear frontline operators reaction to, you want me to do more? You told me that our KPIs or our performance last week was enough.
Now you're asking me to do more. You're always want more.
But I think a lot of that has to do with how was articulation of performance outcomes last week delivered and how was the mindset influenced by the leader of those operators surrounding what it means to achieve enough for the moment and now there's more.
[00:55:40] Speaker C: Always time limited.
[00:55:41] Speaker B: Right.
So I think a leader's thoughtfulness in recognizing that what was enough, equate it to specific outcomes and what's to come, connects to a new measure for what's enough.
[00:55:56] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. That's just. In my opinion, that's a failure to say for now at the end. Right. It's enough for now.
Right. Because enough is always going to be time limited and outcomes continually change. Right. Like the outcome doesn't stay the same sometimes from minute to minute, depending on the industry.
Even in the work that I do when I'm teaching a class or when I'm working With a client, outcomes shift all the time. Clients come in, they set goals that they perceive based on their current understanding of self, life, need. And then as you do the work and you get a little closer to you. Like to me, true humility is really getting in closer proximity to yourself and determining whether you like that person or not. You know what I mean? And I think that, well, that's the work that I do in therapy with clients. And the closer they get to.
To truly who they are, good, bad, indifferent, and all the stuff in between, the closer they get, guess what happens? Outcomes or the desired outcome changes. Right? And then we're measuring outcomes along the way, and we're saying, you know what, your depression score, it went down. It went down six points. And that's amazing. And we're gonna celebrate that. Why? Because it's enough for now. Those six points created space for you to get beyond. Right. Sorry, I gesture a lot, but to get beyond. You know what I mean?
So it's the same kind of thing.
You know, companies, organizations have diagnostic processes. They have, you know, ways to look at, okay, what is sufficient, what is insufficient.
But almost always the goalpost is going to move. It just is.
[00:57:35] Speaker B: Yeah. No, no, well said, well said.
I want to pivot in our. In our final segment and get into TIPS practices.
[00:57:47] Speaker C: Right?
[00:57:48] Speaker B: How do we translate this into a tangible action in a simplistic way that our listeners and viewers can begin to apply today, tomorrow, next week? Right?
[00:58:02] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:58:03] Speaker B: So tune in as we explore this practice of humility in the context of leading in our lives, both oneself, our family, our team members. What does that really mean? And how do we balance our desire for accepting what we have accomplished or what we have been able to influence with pursuit of more?
And how do we navigate that both emotionally and really, through a practical lens? Stay tuned.
[00:58:49] Speaker A: Leadership isn't just glossy headlines and Perfect wins. I'm Dr. Dante Vaughn, business strategist, culture architect, guide to leaders who want more than something.
[00:59:00] Speaker B: Status on Everyday Leaders Unfiltered.
[00:59:02] Speaker A: We bring you honest conversations about what's happening behind the curtain. The real setbacks, real pivots, real growth. From culture shifts to personal mastery, from trust crises to team turnarounds, this is where leaders get raw, real and ready.
Everyday Leaders Unfiltered premieres soon on NOW Media Television. Because a leader who's unfiltered might just become unforgettable.
[00:59:42] Speaker B: Welcome back to our final segment.
We've been unpacking the truths as it relates to what's required for us to lean into our own self examination and what's required for us to show up effectively as a leader, and we've been talking about it through the lens or the topic of vulnerability and humility, what's required for us to be effective in how we show up in the lives of others. And as part of that, we recognize that there's no easy or simple answer, but there's a lot of self work required as much as it is in our ability to then translate to our team members in an effective way.
I want to move from foundational understanding and theory to practice what's required for one to navigate what we've discussed in the first three segments. Understanding one's own vulnerabilities and limitations, what's required for us to reach that level of understanding, and then how that translates to driving motivation and ultimately performance with our team members. How do we accept those limitations and also move beyond them from an organizational performance standpoint, individual performance standpoint, how do we get there? So we're going to unpack that through a more tangible lens. And, and during our commercial break, there was something, davita, that you spoke to that I think our viewers need to hear.
As we transition into the segment, can you restate what you said earlier? It doesn't have to be verbatim, but the context of what you said?
[01:01:27] Speaker C: I was just reflecting with you that when people fill out their exit interviews, what they're reflecting on is not Whether or not Q1's goals got met or whether or not they hit those, you know, sort of organizational outcomes. What they're reflecting on is the people who lead them. They're reflecting on specifically the character of the people who lead them.
Sometimes that looks like, like, okay, this person's disorganized and that, that's more of a, you know, a functional thing that you can fix. And, you know, and then sometimes it's that person's kind of a jerk, right? Or that leader never listened to anything I said, right. Or hired me, but never used my skill set or expert expertise.
So I was just reflecting that, you know, it's, it's more than just being willing to say for the, as the leader being willing to say, okay, fine, I acknowledge, right, it does require that it gets lived out. And that's where that humility piece comes in.
[01:02:22] Speaker B: I think that's profound and spot on. And oftentimes we look for, even on these type of platforms, those other topics like this one is different in that there's a lot of self work required and it's not so clear the path to begin that work and to realize it. But to your point, there's a necessity in that work to the minute we decide that we want to assume a capacity of true leadership of people.
Not management of systems, processes, resources, but leadership of people.
This is a part of it, folks.
And one of the things that I'm very passionate about is the ownership and the responsibility that comes with leadership to truly be a leader, which requires this level of work. So I'm so grateful that we're navigating this topic. That can feel kind of heavy and complex for some. So you're great at really taking something complex and simplifying it. How do we get to the state where this becomes tangible in practice? What do I do tomorrow to start to lean in on that humility, you know, skill set and apply it with my team members?
[01:03:52] Speaker C: Yeah.
For every person listening, write your resignation letter.
We started by saying it's easier to write the resignation letter than it is the resume, because it's easier to acknowledge what is wrong than what is right. If you had to quit yourself, why?
Why would you give up that work?
Why would you give up the job of becoming a better human being or more humble human being, a better leader? Why would you give all of that up? Why? What's the reason? Write the letter, write it, and then read it over and over and over again till you have a feeling about the things you are reading.
Notice if there is avoidance of certain parts. Notice if there is strong resistance to some parts. Notice if some parts just make you angry. Right. Know what you feel about the things you are reading. Because what you wrote down, I promise you, will be a part of your character. It'll be a part of your personality development. It'll be a part of things that maybe you learned that it's time to unlearn as a leader.
Write the resignation letter.
Do that work first, then write the resume.
Bright. Acknowledge strengths through the resume, limitations through the resignation letter. We're saying that the formula overly simplified for humility is strengths plus limitations equals humble.
If you can have a document that says, wow, I would quit myself because all of these things are wrong. All of these things are maybe not wrong, but limitations.
Some of the limitations, some of the things in that resignation letter will be difficult to change or will take many, many years to change, right?
And then some things in the resume maybe need development, right? But when you have it in front of you, it's a good way to start the process of saying, here is how I can grow humility.
[01:05:51] Speaker B: I love the practicality of that. I want to unpack That a little bit, just for the sake of clarity for our listeners and viewers, the resignation letter. I am resigning from self on the basis of experiences that I have to acknowledge are self inflicted.
[01:06:13] Speaker C: Yes.
[01:06:14] Speaker B: So I want to make sure that's very clear. You are not writing a resignation letter to your employer and please do not his sin unless you really want to do that.
But this is more of I resign. This is powerful because this is also something that I think we can do for our lives. Personally, I resign from.
[01:06:38] Speaker C: Yeah.
[01:06:38] Speaker B: I resign from toxic relationships that I know don't serve me, but because of my own insecurities or traumas, I hold on to them.
I resign from.
My tendency to micromanage, to overcompensate for the fact that I don't feel vulnerable enough to share with my team members that I don't fully trust their ability to deliver on an outcome. Therefore I have to to insert my cells in short interval to validate. It's going to get done. It's a trust and communication issue. I resign from my avoidance of that. Right, Right. So for our listeners, that's what we mean when we say write the resignation or when I was getting ready to say Dr. Vaughn, soon to be Dr. Vaughn, references, write the resignation letters, the self resignation letter, and then in tandem to that
[01:07:39] Speaker C: afterward.
[01:07:40] Speaker B: Afterwards, Pardon me, now let me write my resume. Let me project both through the revelations of my resignation letter coupled with what, what is enough?
Let me write my resume.
That's a powerful activity that I think we can all write and really reflect on.
[01:08:03] Speaker C: I think we get used to resigning too. Right.
Well, I'm resigned to the fact that, you know, my employees don't like me because I'm micromanaging. Right.
I resign to the fact that, you know, my turnover rate, I have really poor retention. Right. I resign to the fact we're not necessarily resigning from enough.
[01:08:25] Speaker B: Ooh.
[01:08:26] Speaker C: So this is, this is a way of changing the narrative. And it really is a form of narrative therapy, to be honest with you. But it's a way of saying what is the narrative I currently have that is not helpful. Not serving me to use your language, really not even getting me to enough. Right. And keeping me from beyond and more. Right. And then you're saying, okay, what's left? Right. Like now that I've resigned from all this, what's left? And then you acknowledge that it's enough.
What's left is enough for now.
[01:08:57] Speaker B: For now. Enough for now. And I think that's an important distinction for sure.
I would be remiss. I want to Ensure for our listeners and viewers.
They've heard you now for the past hour, really touch on so many important topics.
How do they reach out to you? How do they get to an opportunity to further the dialogue or expand upon, you know, this topic or other topics?
[01:09:24] Speaker C: Yeah. So anybody that wants to reach me, you can reach me at davita d a v I d aipitavonlpc.com or you can contact me via telephone.
So that's 470-524-2019.
[01:09:45] Speaker B: You just put your phone number out there for the. For the world that he is.
[01:09:49] Speaker C: I thought about that.
[01:09:51] Speaker B: I don't know. Y' all want to edit that.
[01:09:53] Speaker C: Might want to cut that part out.
[01:09:55] Speaker B: But to your point, they can, I would imagine they can find you on LinkedIn as well and message you reach out to you that way as well.
[01:10:03] Speaker C: Yes. That's probably the thing that they should keep in the recording is.
[01:10:07] Speaker B: Yes, because I hope that's not your cell phone number.
[01:10:11] Speaker C: It's my business line.
[01:10:12] Speaker B: Oh, perfect. Well, at least it's business line. So you're good to go. So y' all can keep this part in because it's kind of funny.
With that being said, you know, this has been just awesome. Awesome to. To. To navigate something that can feel heavy and, and. And you've done a phenomenal job in trying to simplify it for us and make it really practical. And I love the exercise of our personal resignation from letter and our personal resume and how that then translates. And again, it applies in our personal lives through the lens of our personal lives. It can apply through the lens of leadership. What do as a team, It's a phenomenal exercise as a team. How do we connect with what we should resign from as a team could literally make a team resignation. And what do you believe have contributed to our successes thus far? And how will it carry us from enough for now to the next level of enough?
With that being said to all our listeners and viewers, thank you for tuning in to Everyday Leaders Unfiltered. We appreciate you hanging in on such an important topic.
To everyone watching, I want you to understand something.
You don't have to become perfect to lead well. You just have to be honest enough to do the inner work so that the people you lead don't pay the price for what you refuse to heal within yourself.
Tune in next time where we'll continue to unpack real, raw and candid topics, conversations that are important and necessary in the lives we live as. In the lives we live as leaders.
Thank you so much. This is what happens when you shoot a segment with your sister.
With that being said, I'm Dr. Dante Fong with Everyday Leaders Unfiltered.
